Top Shortstops in NL

[d-backsfan123]

1.jose reyes
2.jimmy rollins
3.edgar renteria
4.david eckstein
5.hanley ramirez
6.rafael furcal
7.khalil greene


yours?

Someone give me something please?

[BGarrett7]

How about you actually give people longer than thirty minutes before you start begging for replies.

[lmartin6]

Someone give me something please?

........


relax, man. Although some of us may give off the impression, the majority of us don't live on the computer. You'll get a reply when people actually read why you say. Begging for replies isn't the greatest way to get them.


So, if it makes you happy, I'll reply now...

Of course, it's been well documented all over that Jose Reyes is the best that baseball has to offer at SS, and I'll give you Rollins at 2. Then, it's a toss-up. But, and I give him a whole lot of credit due to how hard he plays, but he HAS to play that hard to make up for ability he lacks...What I'm getting at is there is no way in hell David Eckstein is the 4th best SS in the NL. I'd probably put Furcal slightly ahead of Renteria, they both have strentghs over the other but I'd give Furcal a few more. Hanley Ramirez probably belongs in the group with those two. Jack Wilson belongs on the list somewhere, and the way he's playing right now, JJ Hardy is moving on up pretty fast

[gilley22]

You're underrating Ramirez.

[McCarroll21]

Yeah, we're going to have to do something about your blatant spamming if you want to stay around.

But I would take Reyes and Ramirez before anyone else at this point.

I'm partial of our own and Furcal, but that's probably a little biased.

I would guess I would go something like....
Reyes
Ramirez
Rollins
Furcal
RenteriaThen throw in JJ Hardy, Felipe Lopez and MAYBE Jack Wilson and Omar Vizquel. After that, there's really no one worth talking about.

Anyone who thinks Eckstein is a top five SS in the NL needs to go to Tony La Russa's Alcoholics Anonymous group.

[gilley22]

McCarroll's list looks great to me. Anybody who doesn't put Ramirez as #2 needs to realize how good this guy is. He had an OPS of .833 in his rookie year, at the age of 22. Now he's got it at about 1.000. He's a stud, and despite the differing levels of hype, he's not too far behind Reyes.

[FalconPride]

I like how Baseball Prospectus does their prospect rankings so I am going to follow. Just because a player is ranked just behind another player does not mean there's not a major difference. To me, the first two SS are clear and away the best in the NL East, the NL, and the major leagues. Without any real research and just off the tip of my head...

Elite
1. Jose Reyes
2. Hanley Ramirez

Good
3. Rafael Furcal
4. Jimmy Rollins
5. Stephen Drew
6. Edgar Renteria

Better Than Average
7. J.J. Hardy
8. David Eckstein

[CB1]

I would do it like this, even though Rollins has pretty much flopped (in my mind) this season:

Elite
1. Jose Reyes
2. Jimmy Rollins

Very Good
3. Hanley Ramirez
4. Rafael Furcal

Good
5. Edgar Renteria
6. Stephen Drew (still got a lot to prove, in my mind)

Better than Average
7. J.J. Hardy
8. David Eckstein

[McCarroll21]

Rollins has flopped?

AVG - .311
OBP - .367
SLG - .607
OPS - .974
OPS+ - 151

9 HR, 22 RBI, 29 runs scored. He's the only Phillie that is playing.

When 100 is the average for OPS+, if you have a 151 you've done anything but flop.

[jschafer5]

Here's my top 5:

1. Jose Reyes
2. Jimmy Rollins
3. Hanley Ramirez
4. Rafael Furcal
5. Edgar Renteria

[CB1]

Rollins has flopped in the press. :D
We're the team to beat this year.

[McCarroll21]

He can't control the other twenty four guys.

[CB1]

True. That's a good point.
But still, it's fun to knock him. Even though I did put him up above Hanley in the Elite Category. If his stats are like that, then why did you put Hanley above Rollins?

[McCarroll21]

I think Hanley is better than Rollins. I think of Hanley Ramirez as nearly an equal of Jose Reyes without as good of a team around him.

I was just pointing out that Rollins hasn't flopped this year like your post implied.

[FalconPride]

This year:
Hanley Ramirez - .352/.440/.565
Jimmy Rollins - .311/.367/.607

Last year:
Hanley Ramirez - .292/.353/.480
Jimmy Rollins - .277/.334/.478

To me, the question isn't how can I put Ramirez over Rollins, but is Jose Reyes good enough to put over Ramirez. I think he is, but I'm not too sure.

[McCarroll21]

It's very close FP. Most people leave Hanley out of the discussion of best young player in the NL East, when in fact, he may be the best one.

I think if you put Hanley on the Mets and Reyes on the Marlins, they'd probably swap stat lines as well as teams.

[Vuchato]

Reyes/Hanley/Rollins/Renteria/Eckstein/Lopez/Furcal/Tulowitzki/Greene/Drew

[cjones1999]

here is my top 5:
1.reyes
2.ramirez
3.furcal
4.edgah
5.rollins

[BGarrett7]

One could very easily make the argument that Eckstein is the worst shortstop in the NL.

[McCarroll21]

I would be there BGarrett.

Guzman and Izturis are the only two that stick out in my mind as "worse." And it appears that Izturis has lost his job to Theriot, anyway.

I put Eckstein in the camp with Adam Everett.

[Hobbes]

One could very easily make the argument that Eckstein is the worst shortstop in the NL.
But wait, he's gritty and he hustles!

[BGarrett7]

But wait, he's gritty and he hustles!He's a grinder, damnit!

Eckstein and Erstad... The two best players in all of baseball!

[McCarroll21]

But wait, he's gritty and he hustles!
Ugh! For real. That's the reason he's even put here. He's literally the 13th-14th best SS in the NL. He's Rey Ordonez without the defense, but white and runs funny at the same time.

Man. If more people got love for being gritty, Matt Diaz would be an All-Star and one of the best LF in the game.

[lmartin6]

Ugh! For real. That's the reason he's even put here. He's literally the 13th-14th best SS in the NL. He's Rey Ordonez without the defense, but white and runs funny at the same time.

Man. If more people got love for being gritty, Matt Diaz would be an All-Star and one of the best LF in the game.

Just imagine how good Langerhans would be. And how bad LaRoche would suck

[McCarroll21]

LOL! LaRoche is working on not even needing to suck when using the grit scale.

[BGarrett7]

Just imagine how good Langerhans would be. And how bad LaRoche would suckWe don't have to imagine how bad LaRoche sucks, he's doing a fine job of showing us on his own.

[FalconPride]

It's very close FP. Most people leave Hanley out of the discussion of best young player in the NL East, when in fact, he may be the best one.

I think if you put Hanley on the Mets and Reyes on the Marlins, they'd probably swap stat lines as well as teams.
My one reason on keeping Reyes number one is pretty simple, but not a backed up by statisical or tangible evidence thing.

There is not one player who scares me more at the plate than Jose Reyes. Not Albert Pujols, not Barry Bonds, nobody...when Reyes steps in, I'm waiting for him to beat me.

[McCarroll21]

I can see that. I feel much the same, but if Hanley were in that lineup, he'd probably have the same "vibe" going on.

Who knows, they're both very good and in my opinion the elite shortstops of , not only the league, but of the entire game.

[Vuchato]

Eckstein gets on a decent amount, has solid speed and defense, and most importantly, was WS MVP. Plus, he tries hard, and is the type of guy you love to have.

[lmartin6]

Eckstein gets on a decent amount, has solid speed and defense, and most importantly, was WS MVP. Plus, he tries hard, and is the type of guy you love to have.

Eckstein is nothing more than a glorified Pete Orr

[BGarrett7]

Eckstein gets on a decent amountBut not nearly enough to be an effective leadoff hitter.

and most importantly, was WS MVP.You do realize that he started the WS by going 0-11, and didn't reach base until his third AB of the third game, correct? Even once he did reach base three times that game, he still only had a .214 OBP. Rolen got dicked.

Plus, he tries hard, and is the type of guy you love to have.He's the type of guy I love to have if I want a blackhole at the top of my order.

[FalconPride]

David Eckstein is a media darling. The ugly duckling that surprises everyone of us and lets us know that anyone can have their 15 minutes and unlike so many people who get those 15, Eckstein had something to be proud about.

David Eckstein has had a few decent years. In 2002 and 2005, he was a passable major league starter. He got over the 4.5 RC/27 (hardly that great, mind you) and touched league average in his adjusted OPS. But he's an average basestealer, is nothing but a singles hitter, and somehow stole the World Series MVP from Scott Rolen.

Thank God Eckstein's a pretty decent fielder...or he'd be completely worthless.

[Vuchato]

David Eckstein is a media darling. The ugly duckling that surprises everyone of us and lets us know that anyone can have their 15 minutes and unlike so many people who get those 15, Eckstein had something to be proud about.

David Eckstein has had a few decent years. In 2002 and 2005, he was a passable major league starter. He got over the 4.5 RC/27 (hardly that great, mind you) and touched league average in his adjusted OPS. But he's an average basestealer, is nothing but a singles hitter, and somehow stole the World Series MVP from Scott Rolen.

Thank God Eckstein's a pretty decent fielder...or he'd be completely worthless.


completely worthless by being average? look, I'm not saying he's a HOF'er, just that he's a solid starter.

[d-backsfan123]

ok u guys got me i was completely wrong about eckstein sorry :( i didnt realize how bad he was