Give me you top NL 2nd basemen

[d-backsfan123]

give me your top NL second basemen here are mine:

1.Orlando Hudson
2.Chase Utley

[Hobbes]

You waited 1 minute before wondering why you received no responses?

And as a D-Backs fan you should know that Hudson is playing way above his head right now. No way is he a better 2B than Utley.

[vnodnarb]

Utley is the clear #1 and then there is everyone else, i think Kelly will def be considered top 5 after this season

[d-backsfan123]

will become an all-star this year i mean come on last he was not doing to well before the all-star break and now ever since hes been putting up top of the league numbers, my prediction for o-dog opinions on if you think they will come true.

2b Gold Glove
1st string 2007 All-star
silver slugger 2b
all of this is for 2007 :) ty

[d-backsfan123]

excuse me? o-dog putting up career numbers on a hot streak anybody who watches knows by seasons end o-dog will be number 1...chase utley dont get me wrong is definately the number2 but o-dog by far number 1

[BGarrett7]

Gold gloves, Silver Slugger awards and all-star selections are all absolutely meaningless. You can have as many as you want and it doesn't mean dick.

[d-backsfan123]

im sorry im just saying i think he will lead the league in those categories i know numbers aren't evrything but.... they do tell some stories and just to let you know orlando is a great guy who gets involved in the community as well al playing good....

[Hobbes]

excuse me? o-dog putting up career numbers on a hot streak anybody who watches knows by seasons end o-dog will be number 1...chase utley dont get me wrong is definately the number2 but o-dog by far number 1
Yeah, okay.

Moving along, nothing to see here.

[d-backsfan123]

um... you guys obviously havent watched o-dog thats all im gonna say...

[LSU31always]

um... you guys obviously havent watched o-dog thats all im gonna say...
And you haven't watched Utley
Utley is here
















































O-Dog is here

[BGarrett7]

Numbers are very important, it just depends on what numbers you are using. Stats like batting average and fielding percentage are useless. And being a good guy doesn't win ballgames, so don't bring that crap.

[d-backsfan123]

that was really just overall really really gay

[nj_chops]

excuse me? o-dog putting up career numbers on a hot streak anybody who watches knows by seasons end o-dog will be number 1...chase utley dont get me wrong is definately the number2 but o-dog by far number 1

O-Dog, Meet C-Dawg (http://tinyurl.com/yupyw3)

[Hobbes]

um... you guys obviously havent watched o-dog thats all im gonna say...
2006 stats:

R HR RBI AVG OBP SLG OPS
A 131 32 102 .309 .379 .527 .906
B 87 15 67 .287 .354 .454 .808Which do think was "O-Dog"?

[LSU31always]

2006 stats:

R HR RBI AVG OBP SLG OPS
131 32 102 .309 .379 .527 .906
87 15 67 .287 .354 .454 .808

Which do think was "O-Dog"?
I know who is who

[d-backsfan123]

read this Hudson AVG350 HR 4 RBI 25 OBP .413 SLUG .537 (gold glover)
Utley AVG.300 HR 5 RBI 25 OBP .387 SLUG .558

out of these two who would u take?

[d-backsfan123]

umm wut stats do u look at then?

[Hobbes]

read this Hudson AVG350 HR 4 RBI 25 OBP .413 SLUG .537 (gold glover)
Utley AVG.300 HR 5 RBI 25 OBP .387 SLUG .558

out of these two who would u take?
The one who has proven over multiple seasons that his numbers aren't an April fluke.

Nothing is worse than homers with blinders on.

[BGarrett7]

Two words: Sample. Size. Give me Utley every day of the week. Saying Hudson is better based on April is like saying Soriano is the worst CF in the league right now.

[McCarroll21]

This is comical, but I wouldn't expect less from a D-Backs fan. Beat the Mets and you may get some love around here. :D

At least Braves fans aren't totally blinded by a month of the season. Well, not most on this site anyway.

Defensively, Hudson is in a league of his own, though Giles is right there [just not as graceful] and I seriously think Johnson is on his way.

Offensively, Utley is in a league of his own. And then there are quite a few more before you get to Hudson.

And even if you are blinded by the start of 2007, you may want to compare the OPS of Orlando Hudson and Kelly Johnson. Take a look at the stats and get back to me.



Oh, and I merged the other Hudson thread with this one. Keep things in here, we need to keep the fanboy stuff into one area.

[FalconPride]

Homerism should be a crime. There is a clear difference between loving your team and being so illogical that when you try to compare and contrast between your team and others, all you really see is your team. Orlando Hudson and his career adjusted OPS of 97 would struggle to even get into the top five second basement in the NL, his great start be damned. Under that asinine thinking, KJ and Hudson would be better than Chase Utley and anyone who has ever...thought...could figure out what's wrong there. Under that thinking, Manny Ramirez is not a great hitter.

Seriously...what the hell?

If you really want to talk about this...

Elite
1. Chase Utley

Very Good
2. Jeff Kent
3. Dan Uggla
4. Marcus Giles
5. Kelly Johnson
6. Orlando Hudson

Better Than Average
7. Rickie Weeks
8. Brandon Phillips

You may notice...I don't go too crazy for a month of success. Doing it for a full year at a high level is important.

[CB1]

Homerism should be a crime. There is a clear difference between loving your team and being so illogical that when you try to compare and contrast between your team and others, all you really see is your team. Orlando Hudson and his career adjusted OPS of 97 would struggle to even get into the top five second basement in the NL, his great start be damned. Under that asinine thinking, KJ and Hudson would be better than Chase Utley and anyone who has ever...thought...could figure out what's wrong there. Under that thinking, Manny Ramirez is not a great hitter.

Seriously...what the hell?

If you really want to talk about this...

Elite
1. Chase Utley

Very Good
2. Jeff Kent
3. Dan Uggla
4. Marcus Giles
5. Kelly Johnson
6. Orlando Hudson

Better Than Average
7. Rickie Weeks
8. Brandon Phillips

You may notice...I don't go too crazy for a month of success. Doing it for a full year at a high level is important.
I totally agree with that, though I would now flip Kent and Uggla, just for how Kent has looked today.

[McCarroll21]

I totally agreewith that, though I would now flip Kent and Uggla, just for how Kent has looked today.
The point in tiering it off like that is to show that anyone in each group could be argued to be the best of that group on any day. Or at least that's how I take it.

I don't see much of a difference between Kelly and any of those guys right now, but he's got to sustain it and show he didn't just have a good month, same with Hudson.

[d-backsfan123]

..oh man oh man you guys are full of it saying kent is having a better year then hudson man wtf?

[GrandMasterB]

..oh man oh man you guys are full of it saying kent is having a better year then hudson man wtf?

I don't think anyone is disputing that Hudson is having a better year than Kent <i>so far this year</i>. However, it's only been a month. Supporting your team and it's players is fine, but don't be ignorant. Look over their careers and tell me who is the more established player.

[Jsh1284]

I thought Hudson was the all-time leader in homers by a second baseman? Oh yeah, that's Kent ... my bad.

[McCarroll21]

..oh man oh man you guys are full of it saying kent is having a better year then hudson man wtf?
Hudson's career high batting average (.287), on-base percentage (.354) and slugging (.454) are all worse than Kent's career numbers.

.290/.356/.504

Tell me how exactly we're full of it to say Kent is better when Hudson's career year last year didn't even match Kent's career averages?

[FalconPride]

..oh man oh man you guys are full of it saying kent is having a better year then hudson man wtf?
Again, homerism is a crime.

You do realize it's a season, not a month, right?

I'm not too sure you do.

[Vuchato]

Those of you worried about Kelly not being able to produce, don't worry. He's been a middle of the order LF most of his career. When he was called up, it was to provide offense out of LF, and replace Chipper in the lineup. Considering he was supposed to be a plus hitter at a corner outfield spot, I don't think there'll be much of an issue with his performance decreasing, and even then he'll still be a top 2B.

[cjones1999]

homerism is a crime




thank you FP

1.utley
2.kent
3.KJ
4.gilly
5.uggla

[lmartin6]

..oh man oh man you guys are full of it saying kent is having a better year then hudson man wtf?

No one has said he's having a better year. To argue who's the better at what position, you have to look at more than a few games. If we went on a game-by-game basis to determine who was the best, Betemit would be the best hitter in the majors right now. He's 2 for 2 with 2 homers in the last two games. But, those of us who can think logically know there's a lot more that goes into it than that.

[d-backsfan123]

OK im sorry i said utley was better... but on this thread i was intentding to talk about this seasons best 2bmen not their career u guys got me Utley is better then hudson in his career as well as kent, i was talking about this season though k? :)

[McCarroll21]

Up to date this season, Kelly Johnson is the best 2nd baseman in the NL. Will he stay there? Who knows, wouldn't bet on it.

OPS (MLB.com)
KJ - 1.021
Utley - .944
Hudson - .932
All others below .900

WPA (Fangraphs.com)
KJ - 1.82
Hudson - 0.94
Phillips - 0.83
All others below 0.65

Runs Created/27 outs (Fangraphs.com)
KJ - 10.33
Ultey - 8.74
Hudson - 7.62
Giles - 7.03
All others below 7.0

Clutch (Fangraphs.com) [WPA-(OPS Wins*pLI)]
KJ - 0.62
Belliard - 0.60
.....
Hudson - 0.06
.....
Utley - -0.58

You can go here (http://www.fangraphs.com/glossary/index.php?n=Glossary.Glossary) for definitions and formulas for the things from Fangraphs.com.


Those stats right there show that you can't just judge who is the best through one month of a season.

[was385]

This is one of more ridiculous posts I have seen.